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Discussion Starter · #341 ·
Well for starters, I don't put a lot of stock in the ads on JamesList.

There aren't any F1s with automatic transmissions - that's for sure.

I know of two F1s currently in Hong Kong - #016 & #064 - but the car in that photo is actually #068, taken about 5 years ago in Costa Rica.

There is a chance the ad could relate to #064 based on the location and mileage and year, but I wouldn't guarantee that.

>8^)
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Discussion Starter · #342 ·
06scoob - your pics have been with me since January 4th, 2004. I was trying to recall today where I might have discovered them and perhaps your screenname offers a clue. Is there a chance you shared these on i-club.com back then? If so, that would definitely be where I found them.

Anyway - here they are again complete with your original filenames. I have no idea why the "cockpit" photo is so much larger than the rest of them but I'm sure I saved them at the highest resolution you offered. 2004 was just a couple of years into my pursuit of F1s so I am sure I was thrilled to find these when I did. Glad that I can now share them back with you. :cool:





That 550 Barchetta he had in Tour de France Blue is also a beauty.

>8^)
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Discussion Starter · #344 · (Edited)
One more thing maybe you can help me with?

These four shots are some of the earliest ones I have of #044 - with me since Oct 2002. They show it wearing a "Chamber's Motorcars" placard in place of a rear license plate, but interestingly (to me anyway) there's a UK registration plate on the nose.



With the "Winston Cup" logos in the background they were surely taken somewhere in the USA, but the UK plate intrigues me. I know that Herb's F1 entered the US in the late 1990's as one of the Ameritech F1s. What I do not know is where it was and who owned it between the time it was built and when he ended up with it. There's always the possibility that he was the original owner and kept the car in the UK but that probably is not the case. It seems more likely that someone else had it first and that it originated from the UK.

If there's ever a chance you'd be able to ask about the car's history and that UK license plate I'd love to hear the back story. Thanks! :)

>8^)
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Discussion Starter · #345 · (Edited)
I know I am going to start sounding like a broken record, but there's some speculation that this ad may not be legit. Those pictures are from October 2005 when the car was for sale in Germany by KS Autohandel. The red license plate seen on the front of the car has been added in Photoshop - here is the original image direct from my archive:



All of the other shots on that website are borrowed from the web as well.

The orange GTR in the photos is #11R and for a long time it was owned by a Swede who had it road registered and exercised it often (relatively speaking). He also loaned it to German magazine 'Auto Motor & Sport' for use in an article and this video:

Garaget | Prestanda superbilar

Then when it was sold in 2006, it went to a new owner in Northern Italy who also used it at least once at Paul Ricard. See this excellent video:

Watch Video Mclaren F1 GTR på Paul-Ricard at blinkx

And it was also spotted at a gas station in Italy wearing it's proper plate:

YouTube - mclarenf1

Certainly all that use, along with the testing McLaren does when an F1 is serviced, would have put far more than 300 kms on the car. Not to mention that it raced for a year in the BPR series and at LeMans in 1996... ;)

Last but not least is the price. It is no longer shocking to see an F1 road car sell for $3.5M US dollars since it has happened more than once, but GTRs don't tend to pull such high figures. For it to have an asking price equivalent to $3.8M US dollars is way out of line with what they typically trade for. Of course owners can ask for whatever price they like (sometimes they are just fishing) but put it all together and this is another ad that doesn't seem to have a whole lot of credibility.

>8^)
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I saw on another page Peloton25's diecast collection! Do you have any UT Models Mclaren F1's?? their prices have skyrocketed like crazy ever since UT went out of business. Some were on ebay for $500+.

Also, Autoart (the company that bought out UT) has just released the most detailed 1/18 McLaren F1 ever! everything opens including trunks on the side $260
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Discussion Starter · #348 ·
I have about 12 F1 models by UT. Haven't bought one of the AutoArt's yet but I am thinking about getting a black one and hand-painting the red stripe on the door so that it looks like #015 that belongs to Jay Leno. :cool:

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I used to work at Herb Chambers Honda. He is a super nice guy and I don't think I ever saw him in the same car twice (besides his phantom)
 

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Hello Peloton. Ive followed you through many forums (many from YEARS AGO) and I signed up here becuz I loved the forum and you had posted very recently.

I have been obsessed with this car (which first launched around the time I learned to talk) for half my life. When I was playing Need For Speed 3 (HP1) around the time I was 10 or 11 I was intensely curious why this car was leaps and bounds beyond the other exotics. I learned almost all there was to learn spec-wise about the F1 in H.S. My cousin just gave me a 1:18 diecast of the road car and thats how I got refueled on this amazing car.

First I would like to thank you for your dedication to sharing you love and knowledge. Im sure you grow tired of all the praise, but theres no way I can let that go unsaid.

I was wondering what happened to Frank's 2 cars. If you mentioned it somewhere in this thread you can just direct me there. I perused all 36 pages but I don't recall the story.

I also wondered if anyone ever tried aftermarket add-ons to increase high speed. In a way I hope not. Someone mentioned turbos on another forum, and I got very sick.

Also, by your count, how many driveable examples of the Mclaren (all types) still remain. It was 106 but it seems a couple must have been damaged beyond repair such as the recent one in Cali and the Sultans. (Does the Sultan still have 7?)

If any of these questions are answered in this thread, feel free to skip them, as I plan on reading thru all the info again. I live in Cali and am definitely going to make a serious effort to get a glimpse of one before I die lol

Thanks for sharing!

-Christopher
 

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Discussion Starter · #359 · (Edited)
Glad you and many others continue to enjoy the thread Christopher. :)

Even if those questions are answered here already, it would be easier for me to answer them again then find them, so no worries either way.

Frank actually had three F1s - the black road car (#007) and the F1 LM (LM3) are the ones that most people know about. He also had a silver F1 (#068) which was the first McLaren he purchased, and he kept it until mid-2005.

Most people don't know about his ownership of the silver F1 because it never came home to Boston. When he purchased it, no one had yet developed a solution for achieving OBD-II compliance with the EPA for the F1, which is a requirement for importing cars built in 1996 or later. While he owned the silver car, he spent the money to have someone design a solution, but even when that work was completed he chose to leave the car in storage. It only had its original delivery mileage on it from McLaren and had never been registered so keeping it that way made the most sense since he still had #007 to drive.

In December of 2004 he sold the LM to Ralph Lauren. Ralph still has it in his collection and very soon you will find it and 16 of his other fantastic cars in Paris at the Musee des Arts Decoratifs in a display that runs from April 28th until August 28th.

The silver F1 was sold in mid-2005 to a collector from Costa Rica. It remained there until mid-2009 when it was sold back to another gentleman from the Boston area who kept the car for approximately 1 year. Then it was sold to a new owner in the UK where I believe it still remains now.

Frank's black F1 which he owned for about a decade and seemed to drive as much as the weather would allow, was sold to a new owner in Geneva, Switzerland in early 2010. It was disappointing to see this car leave the USA as it had such an active and public life here. It's new owner is cut from the same cloth as they say, and drives the car all around Europe to different events. He even filmed this fantastic high-speed video which has probably been shared here already. It is quite a thrill to watch - and has the most intoxicating sounds of speed. :clap:


Keep in mind that on an F1's speedo, 200 mph is at the 12 o'clock position, so you're seeing a max of about 210 mph there.


I've not seen or heard of any extensive modifications to the F1 powerplant like the addition of turbos. If there is one thing the F1 doesn't need, it is more power and you'd have to be a bit insane to go toying with that engine. The factory has fitted LM-spec engines to a couple of road cars, and there is a company called Quicksilver that does make an exhaust for the F1.

Driveable F1s - most of them actually. I do know of at least 5 cars which have been reportedly destroyed:

XP1 - crashed in Africa undergoing hot weather testing early in the F1 development program. Picture

XP2 - was the car used for the barrier crash test at MIRA in the UK and while it survived that in drivable condition I was told by Gordon Murray that it was a rather crude example anyway and had later been scrapped. Picture

#004 or #005 - One of the cars in Brunei was totaled by a mechanic, but so far we've been unable to determine exactly which one it was. If I had a picture, I'd have the answer as one car was red and the other black.

#010 - totaled by Bernd Pischetstrieder, then President of BMW AG, in Germany back in 1997. The car went off the road and flipped a couple of times but neither him, his wife or a family friend who were on-board were badly injured. Picture

#017 - crashed into a tree on rain slicked roads in the UK and caught fire in March 1999. The driver and his two passengers all died in the crash. I've seen video clips that were broadcast on the news in the UK the day of the accident and there wasn't much left that could be used to identify the car. :( Out of respect for the families given that lives were lost, I won't share any images.

#033 - perhaps this makes number 6 on the list. It was crashed heavily into an armco on the Autobahn while traveling at 170 mph the same week as BP crashed #010. The factory claimed the car was repairable but the owner reportedly wanted a new one anyway. It's unclear what has happened to what was left of the car but it has yet to appear anywhere else since. Picture

Other F1s that have been crashed heavily and repaired include #009 in Australia (seen here), #024 which bounced from curb to curb while crossing the Hammersmith Bridge in the UK, and #067 which was crashed by Tesla CEO, Elon Musk, while he was head of X.com (eventually became PayPal).

Everyone knows about Mr Bean's F1 crash (Picture), and most probably also saw pics of the blue one that crashed on the Autobahn last year, but the damage to the front of both cars looked much worse than it really was and they were easily repaired. There have been other small shunts that got less publicity, but the factory have every ability to put the cars back together good as new when that happens.

You mentioned 'the recent one in Cali'. I assume you are referring to the one that caught fire in Santa Clara in mid-2009. While initial reports (and gruesome photos) suggested that car would also be totalled, thankfully that isn't the case at all. This was actually #067 again, but now with a different owner, and when the factory received the car back they determined it was a mere 12 seconds away from being a complete loss. :eek:

Here's an article that tells the story in great detail:

A McLaren F1’s Rise from the Ashes

If you look back at the EVO #145 scans I posted here the silver car being reassembled in the "Harold's Workshop" article is #067.

On the Brunei portion of your question, there were originally 10 F1s connected to the Brunei Royal Family. They were chassis numbers #002, #004, #005, #008, #014, GTR #09R, LM1, LM4, LM5, and 54F1GT. Chassis #014 was for sale in the UK in 2002 and has been in the USA ever since. As for the other cars, in late 2009 a source in Brunei gained access to the collection and was able to confirm that all the cars besides #004 and #005 were still there. He even claimed their condition was not as bad as some reports might lead you to believe. So that does leave them with 7 cars today, and I suspect if we had this discussion in another 5 years they probably won't have moved very far. :eek:hwell:

>8^)
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Oh dang! I never saw that news article about the California McLaren. Its great to know its back in action. I assumed that it was a goner.

Those leaked photos of the Brunei LM are pretty spectacular, along with the scan of the same LM in the factory.


When I was in High School I remember hoping and praying some info or pics of the Sultans collection would get released.

I'm sure you noticed, but there was an interview with Gordon in the last issue of Car and Driver.
 
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