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Finally found the EVO issue with the McLaren F1 special in it at Barnes & Noble.
Absolutely brilliant. If you haven't picked it up, you better get to it! Must have for McLaren F1 fans
 

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Discussion Starter #222
I've never seen a variation like that to the pedals on any F1s. This is the standard pedal box in a road car and even the GTRs have similar floor mounted pedals.



It seems like any kind of conversion would be pretty complicated. As you can see in the picture above there's not really a solid structure to hang them on from above. Also, the rods running forward from the pedals directly actuate the Brembo master cylinders that are mounted on the other side of the front bulkhead as you can see in this pair of photos. There are two for the brakes and one for the clutch.



To alter the pedal positions you'd have to totally revise that setup, and this would probably require a uniquely cast front bulkhead built into the monocoque.

Did you hear of this somewhere as I am kind of curious what sparked the question?

>8^)
ER
 

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Discussion Starter #224
Like any car, each F1 is going to be different both with its history and condition which can have a noticeable effect on the price. In the most general terms I think you'd be hard pressed to find an F1 road car in great condition with an asking price of less than $2.5M and GTRs tend to trade for a little bit less, so lets say an even $2.0M for one of them. The range on both doesn't go much lower unless the car has a considerable number of miles, has not been well cared for or has had some unfortunate incident in its past. The longtail GTRs are kind of in a league of their own with a wide spectrum of prices and the same is true of the LMs & GTs which I won't even speculate on.

There's a '95 F1 GTR set to be auctioned in just 10 days during the upcoming Le Mans Classic. The company running the auction have issued a pre-sale estimate of €2m-2.5m (or $2.5-$3.7M USD) banking on it's 'art car' status, but I am tempted to believe that's a pretty ambitious. It's still fully a GTR, not yet having been converted for road use like so many others which will limit its appeal to some buyers I think. It will be interesting to see where the hammer falls and whether it will actually be sold.

You can read more about the car and see plenty of images here:

Artcurial Motorcars - GTR 05R

>8^)
ER
 

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Discussion Starter #225
Just to quote what's written there:

Customized to the preference of each owner, no two McLaren F1 pedal sets are exactly alike. Some are closer together, a few have a lip built in to keep feet in place, others are hinged at the top, rather than at the bottom like these. All are brutally efficient and stark in their beauty.
Primarily I take a big issue with the portion I've marked in blue as it's absolutely not the case. Almost every single F1 I've seen evidence of has an identical set of pedals.

The one road car that springs to mind that has any variation in the pedal set it Rowan Atkinson's where the only difference is that the recessed faces of the brake and clutch pedal are painted black instead of grey.



Don't mind the dirt - it was a wet day at Rockingham when this shot was taken, plus this is one F1 that gets quite a bit of use.

The longtail GTRs also have those black faced pedals. In addition to that they have a extra side panel mounted on the gas pedal to help keep the driver's foot in place and not interfere with the throttle cable.



Look closely in that photo and you'll notice there are different mounting points drilled into the floor so that the pedals can be repositioned fore and aft, and slightly left to right for the gas pedal. I looked for similar evidence in many of the road cars I have reference of and didn't find the same pattern of holes in the floor, but perhaps the carpets were covering the evidence. I know there is some adjustment to the road car pedal set for driver positioning. Maybe that adjustment is limited to just what can be done with the set screws on the actuation rods, and not a relocation of the pedal bases like this GTR offers though?

Anyway, I tend to think that the author of that Jalopnik submission was embellishing a little to bolster his case, but just looking at Richard Thompson's excellent photo of those pedals was really all they needed to make the cut for that story in my opinion.

>8^)
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Heres a tough one for ya. What Mclaren f1's does the sultan of Brunei still currently have in his garage? I heard he sold allot of cars off a few years back. Any pics?
This is one of them right?
 

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Like any car, each F1 is going to be different both with its history and condition which can have a noticeable effect on the price. In the most general terms I think you'd be hard pressed to find an F1 road car in great condition with an asking price of less than $2.5M and GTRs tend to trade for a little bit less, so lets say an even $2.0M for one of them. The range on both doesn't go much lower unless the car has a considerable number of miles, has not been well cared for or has had some unfortunate incident in its past. The longtail GTRs are kind of in a league of their own with a wide spectrum of prices and the same is true of the LMs & GTs which I won't even speculate on.

There's a '95 F1 GTR set to be auctioned in just 10 days during the upcoming Le Mans Classic. The company running the auction have issued a pre-sale estimate of €2m-2.5m (or $2.5-$3.7M USD) banking on it's 'art car' status, but I am tempted to believe that's a pretty ambitious. It's still fully a GTR, not yet having been converted for road use like so many others which will limit its appeal to some buyers I think. It will be interesting to see where the hammer falls and whether it will actually be sold.

You can read more about the car and see plenty of images here:

Artcurial Motorcars - GTR 05R

>8^)
ER


thanks for the explanation, appreciate that. Great to see these cars holding their value and even appreciating in most respects. What was the original MSRP if you don't mind me asking?
 

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thanks for the explanation, appreciate that. Great to see these cars holding their value and even appreciating in most respects.
Peleton would know for certain, but I don't believe any of them have ever depreciated.

Is there any other car that's been like that? The MC12 maybe?
 

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The 5 customer McLaren F1 Le Mans' sold new for around 800,000 Pounds Sterling in the 1996-1998 period. Today they're estimated to be worth between 4 and 5.5 Million US Dollars - but don't be surprised if their current owners ask for more should you express your interest in buying one of them.

Pagani Zondas are known to be trading today for 150,000 to 250,000 Euros higher than their original new prices. The last production Zonda F Roadster Clubsport left the factory with a 1 Million Euro price tag - and was promptly snapped up. It's also a safe bet that the values of the Zonda Cinque and Zonda R variants will only increase with time.

Ferrari 250 GTO. Sold new for about $7000-$9000 US Dollars in the late 1950s. Good luck finding one today for anything less than 25 Million US Dollars. And some have hit more than 30 Million.
 

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Discussion Starter #230
Heres a tough one for ya. What Mclaren f1's does the sultan of Brunei still currently have in his garage? I heard he sold allot of cars off a few years back. Any pics?
This is one of them right?
It's actually an easy question to answer. As of last year there were still 7 F1s in Brunei of the 10 they originally purchased. The 10 chassis numbers were #002, #004, #005, #008 #014, GTR 09R, LM1, LM4, LM5 and 54F1GT. The ones that are now missing from the collection over there are #004, #005 and #014.

The car in your photo is #014 and was offered for sale through a London dealer in late 2002. I covered the detailed history of the car here in this earlier post. The car definitely spent some time in Brunei as it was autographed there in 1996 by one 'M Schumacher' and also appeared on the Garage #5 list that circulates the internet. I suspect around the time it was sold it was probably being kept in London and may have been sold as part of the agreement Prince Jefri had made with his brother the Sultan over his mismanagement of the Brunei Investment Agencies funds. It's my understanding that even today there is still a steady stream of cars in and out of Brunei itself, but they tend to keep the special cars which are appreciating in value like the F1s inside the collection. Exactly why this one F1 in particular was released remains a bit of mystery.

For the other two F1s which weren't present last year, the first of them may be kept in a private collection in Monaco. It is perhaps still owned by the BRF, though some have suggested that Vijay Mallya owns the car. Either way, there have been persistent rumors of a red F1 hiding there. Chassis #004 was originally red and the locations of all the other red F1s are well known today so it seems the most likely candidate. The other missing F1 is believed to have been written off in a crash by one of the mechanics working in Brunei. Certainly there was an accident that destroyed an F1, and while the chassis number has never been confirmed #005 remains the most likely possibility for now.

The selection of photos of the Brunei F1s which were actually taken in Brunei is pretty thin - in fact I only know of three. First there's a grainy shot cropped from a scan showing GTR #09R which was finished as a replica of the '95 Le Mans winner. Then there's the photo I shared earlier of their Black F1 GT and finally an image of #008 which was painted Cobalt Blue.





thanks for the explanation, appreciate that. Great to see these cars holding their value and even appreciating in most respects. What was the original MSRP if you don't mind me asking?
The car's were sold over a period of 5 years so the price fluctuated a bit due to currency changes, but it is safe to say they were slightly less than $1M USD when new. The original quoted price in AutoCar's original F1 test was £540,000. Later reports had revised it upwards to as high as £634,500. Take that second figure and calculate it against the average exchange rate from GBP to USD in 1995 and you'll get a $1,053,270. Either way, it was definitely one of those 'If you have to ask...' scenarios. ;)

>8^)
ER
 

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Discussion Starter #231
Peleton would know for certain, but I don't believe any of them have ever depreciated.
There were a few resales in the early years that fell below the F1's initial list price. It wasn't until the gates were opened to the US market that values of the F1 really started to soar. I know of at least three road cars which changed hands for less than $900,000 between 1998 and 2000 and there wasn't anything wrong with them that I am aware of.

The bargain of the century was GTR #27R which sold at auction through Brooks in 2000 for a figure very near $500,000. Condition definitely played a role in that as the car reportedly needed quite a bit of service work, but it remains the lowest selling price I've heard of for an F1.



>8^)
ER
 

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Wow, Thanks! One day hopefully the sultan will open his garage to a good photographer!
I just emailed him lol.
 

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Finally found the EVO issue with the McLaren F1 special in it at Barnes & Noble.
Absolutely brilliant. If you haven't picked it up, you better get to it! Must have for McLaren F1 fans
Thanks for the heads up. I picked up a copy on Saturday. The issue is awesome with a LOT of F1 content - they did a fantastic job.
 

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Peloton25, You do not know, whether is in Russia McLaren F1???
The audition walks, that in Moscow dark green is. Whether so it? It is very interesting to learn...
In advance I give thanks for the answer.

P.S. I apologise, my English is very bad... I used a translator)))
 

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Discussion Starter #237
Peloton25, You do not know, whether is in Russia McLaren F1???
The audition walks, that in Moscow dark green is. Whether so it? It is very interesting to learn...
In advance I give thanks for the answer.

P.S. I apologise, my English is very bad... I used a translator)))
No problem with your English. It is certainly better than my Russian. ;)

I'm not aware of any F1s in Russia but I don't always know everything. Cars do change hands privately quite often and it can take a while to learn where one may have ended up. If you find out more than just a rumor, let us know. :)

= = =

NoLimit - Enjoy your time with it. :cool:

>8^)
ER
 

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Peloton25, Thanks for the answer
It is a pity, that the information is absent... If that I learn, certainly I will inform!

Good luck!)))
 
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